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| Disagree | 16% | 275 votes | Total: 1729 votes | |
| Agree | 84% | 1454 votes |
Disagree
Created on: December 30, 2007
From the perspective of an outside observer lets begin with what is the reasoning behind wanting a Priest to be celibate? Just because of sex or in spite of sex?
I think in terms of the uniting of the body with god, which if done, results in a celibate lifestyle be you female or male, Priest or not. Ancient teachings and the teachers, whatever they were called, prophets, priests, you name it, were celibate as a result of the absolute union with the one. Spiritually with this union nothing else was a temptation, if in fact you were absolute.
So many instances of corruption in Ashrams and other supposedly spiritual retreats are the result of the inability of man, most men to adhere to a celibate lifestyle, which is of course difficult, and easier said than done. Problem is that when a man is totally open and sensitive to the needs of others he is totally vulnerable to the desires of others, especially females, being that females are totally open to love and is what they want in their lives or life, and when they meet a man who meets that want, spiritual teaching is going by the wayside without strict discipline on the part of the teacher, or Priest, perhaps both, though that is not meant at all to imply the consent of a woman in those circumstances, because the fact of the matter is the woman is so vulnerable at the time, the man may think incorrectly that she is consenting, only though if he is not truly a Spiritual teacher or Priest, etc. Some women have come out of those situations wondering how and what happened, without knowing the why, and in truth there ought not be a why in the situation.
I personally think of it this way, in a Spiritual setting if we truly know what absolute love is and do not share it with all of life then we actually do not know what we think we know of love. In other words love, absolute love has nothing to do with sex, it is only love and sees no bounds or hoops to jump through, and to share that kind of love celibacy is a prerequisite, it actually would not and is not a question, it just is. Which is why again so many get in trouble with the sex, no discipline or will, they give in to the desire to want to make someone feel better physically, which usually in the case of a woman is the reason she is seeking some kind of spiritual comfort from a man, and a Priest or Spiritual teacher is meant to be a haven of tender loving care without the obscurity of some of the idiocy of sex, which takes advantage of the emotional state of the woman.
It is a fact of nature and life, how ever you want to look at it that the practice of Yoga if you get into it all the way the body will calm the mind which is the purpose of the practice, though technically the practice is to allow the body, mind and spirit to unite with the one, call it god, or the nameless, or the universal supreme being. With this union comes great emotional healing and release, which is another reason why the male, usually it was a male teacher or spiritual leader, was celibate, in order to administer to whatever students he had, male or female. I mention Yoga because I believe it is where the practice of modern day religion comes from, though in reality modern day religion is a sham compared to the true Spiritual practice which Yoga. Some people believe Jesus received teachings from Yoga in India. Modern day religion, our let us say in the past two thousand years has been like a practice to make the whole business of Spiritual teachings easier, which the West or European thinking is so good at. In other words it is a moment by moment practice, not just the one or two or three or how ever many times a week someone attends church.
Think of the virgin birth of Jesus, no matter what you believe of the Bible, supposedly the virgin birth was so Mary could be without sin, at least in the religious teaching of Catholicism, well what is sin? When I read of some of the teachings and practices and think of the immaculate conception all I can really think and do believe is the fact that if Mary had that much love in her Spirit then the spirits looking for or choosing the womb carefully just jumped at the chance to be in a place of that much absolute love, so I believe in the concept of an immaculate conception. Though in reality most spirits need to find a man and woman in the union of love and making love to begin the journey back to the physical body again. The Tibetan Book of the Dead is a great resource if you are interested.
That is the whole concept of celibacy in the Priesthood, and why marriage ought not be an option. The other side of it is where the insanity of some of the other problems occurred in the way of Priests being celibate though thinking it is OK to use boys as a release of their undisciplined Spiritual lives with no sexual connection with woman. Man is most likely always the one to be the idiot, which is why the woman is the one with the true power, and why man has tried through the ages to quell her power, with no luck, fortunately for the human race.
Learn more about this author, George Merritt.
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Agree
Created on: May 06, 2011 Last Updated: May 27, 2011
This question of whether or not priests should marry, should only be determined by the Bible and not what men say. This issue falls under a much broader spectrum of what is wrong with most Christian denominations. A denomination may be Christian, believing all the basic Doctrins of Salvation, but in addition adopt certain man made tenancies, under the guise of spiritual enlightenment, that cause division in the overall "Church". All denominations that hold to the basic Gospel truth, who are not considered cults because they either deny Christ's Diety, the Resurrection or that His Sacrifice purchased our salvation, still retain some form of Pharasaical values. Denying marriage is one of those values that the Catholic Church happens to retain.
What do I mean by "Pharasaical values"? A Pharasaical value is a value, rule or law invented by men, instead of by God. There are numerous instances where Christ reprimanded the Pharasees for "tweeking" the laws. They "codified the Scriptures into 365 negative commandments and 248 positive commandments and taught that if men ketp all these, they would be acceptable in the sight of God. (Kay Arthur- Precept upon Precept "Sermon on the Mount" Bible study. The presupposed that God would accept their Doctrines. So, here is what Jesus had to say about that.
Matthew 23:1-12 (NLT)
1 Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples,
2 “The teachers of religious law and the Pharisees are the official interpreters of the law of Moses.
3 So practice and obey whatever they tell you, but don’t follow their example. For they don’t practice what they teach.
4 They crush people with impossible religious demands and never lift a finger to ease the burden.
5 “Everything they do is for show. On their arms they wear extra wide prayer boxes with Scripture verses inside, and they wear robes with extra long tassels.
6 And they love to sit at the head table at banquets and in the seats of honor in the synagogues.
7 They love to receive respectful greetings as they walk in the marketplaces, and to be called ‘Rabbi.’
8 “Don’t let anyone call you ‘Rabbi,’ for you have only one teacher, and all of you are equal as brothers and sisters.
9 And don’t address anyone here on earth as ‘Father,’ for only God in heaven is your spiritual Father.
10 And don’t let anyone call you ‘Teacher,’ for you have only one teacher, the Messiah.
11 The greatest among you must be a servant.
12 But those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.
This scripture above is the best description I can come up with for the term "Pharasaical values". Notice that we have another Catholic "doctrine" in verse nine that actually goes against Christ's words spoken directly out of His mouth. It tells us not to call anyone "Father" as in reference to God, the Father. In Catholicism, priests, bishops, and the Pope, represent God. In a nunnery, the Revernd Mother of a Convent is the direct representative of Christ for that convent. There is an awful lot of room for opinions becoming law in a situation like that and If Christ feels the way he does, as indicated by the Scripture, about not calling priests "Father", then each time you do, you are disobeying God at the behest of the Catholic Church. If you read the rest of Matthey 23 you will see that men who change God's laws in favor of their own have a dim future. There are many of these types of "rules" that the Catholic Church invented and will admit to in their Catholic Encyclopedia as being only church tradition, and not Biblical. Consider the Scripture below as proof that priests should be allowed to marry if they choose.
1 Timothy 4:1-5 (ASV)
1 But the Spirit saith expressly, that in later times some shall fall away from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of demons, 2 through the hypocrisy of men that speak lies, branded in their own conscience as with a hot iron;
3 forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by them that believe and know the truth. 4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing is to be rejected, if it be received with thanksgiving:
5 for it is sanctified through the word of God and prayer.
In this passage, it is clear that the Bible calls forced celibacy a "doctrine of demons" If priests had the right to choose, there would be no false doctrine and no sin against God's word. The context of this passage really hits home when you consider that Paul was outlining the conditions for being a church leader and instructing Timothy, who was bringing this information to Believers
1 Timothy 4:6-16 (ASV)
6 If thou put the brethren in mind of these things, thou shalt be a good minister of Christ Jesus, nourished in the words of the faith, and of the good doctrine which thou hast followed until now:
7 but refuse profane and old wives' fables. And exercise thyself unto godliness:
8 for bodily exercise is profitable for a little; but godliness is profitable for all things, having promise of the life which now is, and of that which is to come.
9 Faithful is the saying, and worthy of all acceptation.
10 For to this end we labor and strive, because we have our hope set on the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of them that believe.
11 These things command and teach.
12 Let no man despise thy youth; but be thou an ensample to them that believe, in word, in manner of life, in love, in faith, in purity.
13 Till I come, give heed to reading, to exhortation, to teaching.
14 Neglect not the gift that is in thee, which was given thee by prophecy, with the laying on of the hands of the presbytery.
15 Be diligent in these things; give thyself wholly to them; that thy progress may be manifest unto all.
16 Take heed to thyself, and to thy teaching. Continue in these things; for in doing this thou shalt save both thyself and them that hear thee.
One of the endearing qualities of the Catholic Church is that she readily admits that these are not Bilbical Doctrines, yet she has not repented of this practice, nor is she quick to inform her members of the discrepancy. Celibacy for the clergy was never a Christian or Biblical value. First of all, there are no "priests" in Christianity for Christ is the only High Priest that we need and we are all called priests under Him (not under a church) ,saints, heirs to his throne and the "temple of the Holy Spirit...each of us...not just priests and nuns. (1 COR. 3:16, 6:19, EPH. 1:1,EPH. 2:6, I PETER 2:5) Now, there are Biblically, church elders and deacons who watch over the flock and the parameters for their Ministry is also given in the one and two Timothy books. Notice in the passage below, the word priest does not appear. There were however, pagan priests when Constantine decreed that all men were to believe in Christ and at that time, church history proves both pagan ritual and the Bible were joined in an unhealthy alliance. It was the first time that the church waw accepted and she was unwilling to "rock" the boat.
1 Timothy 3:1-15 (ASV)
1 Faithful is the saying, If a man seeketh the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 The bishop therefore must be without reproach, the husband of one wife, temperate, sober-minded, orderly, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 no brawler, no striker; but gentle, not contentious, no lover of money;
4 one that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (but if a man knoweth not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 not a novice, lest being puffed up he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have good testimony from them that are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.
8 Deacons in like manner must be grave, not double-tongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;
9 holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
10 And let these also first be proved; then let them serve as deacons, if they be blameless.
11 Women in like manner must be grave, not slanderers, temperate, faithful in all things.
12 Let deacons be husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.
13 For they that have served well as deacons gain to themselves a good standing, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.
14 These things write I unto thee, hoping to come unto thee shortly;
15 but if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how men ought to behave themselves in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.
In verse 2 the Bishop must be the husband of one wife and in verse five it literally states one of the modern arguments made against celebacy. Remember this is not my opinion, but God's. It says that if a man cannot rule his own home, how can he take care of the church of God. As for the nuns, we can see the fallacy of their celebacy in that they "marry" Christ Jesus. God's truth states that the chruch is the Bride of Christ. In the verse below, we see Paul admonishing one of the churches for their deviation from the true Gospel. Here is how he refers to them
2 Corinthians 11:1-4 (NLT)
1 I hope you will put up with a little more of my foolishness. Please bear with me.
2 For I am jealous for you with the jealousy of God himself. I promised you as a pure bride to one husband—Christ.
3 But I fear that somehow your pure and undivided devotion to Christ will be corrupted, just as Eve was deceived by the cunning ways of the serpent.
4 You happily put up with whatever anyone tells you, even if they preach a different Jesus than the one we preach, or a different kind of Spirit than the one you received, or a different kind of gospel than the one you believed.
For too long the church has allowed it's members to abdicate their responsibility to God, by placing undivided devotion to Christ only in the realm of the priesthood and nunneries. Christ is the head of the body as the husband is the head of the wife. We take our marching orders from the Holy Spirit and we must all be spreading the Gospel. Paul, in Roman's 15 refers to himself as a "priest because he spreads the Gospel. The other apostles did this too several of them were married, including Peter. How, in good conscious the Catholic Church can force celebacy on priests when the head of the church was married is beyone me. We, as Christians, are letting nuns and priests do the job that God has set before us, when instead those who are in Ministry are to be helping and guiding us...not living for us. It is my only desire in pointing this out that those under the bondage of these laws be freed and that the Catholic Church return to the Word of God instead of the words of men.
Learn more about this author, Diana Howard.
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